Curse

cce · Mar 09, 2005, 05:46 AM // 05:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sausaletus Rex

Fast Casting is starting to bother me. Like Soul Reaping, it's just not up to par with other primaries. Especially when there's insanely broken, degenerative, and deformative things like Expertise walking around. But, obviously, it was too good when there was no aftercast or it affected the whole casting time not just the activation portion (Or was it? I don't think I was a tester just then.) so it was retouched and having it affect both cast and aftercast to get those quick chain casts that it would seem suited for is probably a bit much.

I don't ever think it was "over powered", even if you can "chain cast", you are going to be limited by mana, and subject to interruptions. Perhaps what they should do is make interruptions a bit more painful, by causing the caster to "reset" for an additional N seconds. I mean, if elementalists get vastly more energy, why not let a mesmer do a bit of chain casting? At lvl 12 strength, 12% penetration is roughly 40% more damage per hit, so why not let a mesmer cast spells 40% faster? Energy storage is about 40% more energy right? From Ensign's tables, a 12 fastcast about 20% faster , not 40%. I think in the october it was closer to 40%, and I thought it was a nice trade-off, I was willing to invest that 11th point (but no more, the 12th was too expensive for the minor speedup). Now it seems the value point is about 6... if at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharalon

The problem is that the actual cast time is generally the important bit. That's what lets you get a skill off faster, just beat your opponent to the punch, fire off that Pheonix before a warrior lands a killing blow. Having it affect aftercast won't help you in those situations where timing is paramount, which I think is what the skill was designed for. It would allow you to squeeze out more spells in a given time period, but that's not really what the attribute is about.

Ok. Then perhaps it should be 55% speedup at lvl 12 before the aftercast, that'd give it roughly a 40% overall reduction in cast time. Being able to pump out 3 spells when an elementalists can only do 2 is the real value, IMHO. Beating someone to the punch is more about reflexes, and not about strategy. I like Guild Wars beacuse it doesn't require me to have fast reflexes.

Sausaletus Rex · Mar 09, 2005, 06:10 AM // 06:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by cce

I don't ever think it was "over powered", even if you can "chain cast", you are going to be limited by mana, and subject to interruptions.

When it was first introduced it was a lot better than what it is now. I forget exactly what it was but it was either a higher percentile reduction, perhaps 5% if not more, or there was no aftercast or some combination of the two. Like when they switched Smiting to ignoring armor (ie it had been balanced to deal with armor, like Fire Storm, but suddenly it ignored armor like Chaos Storm) the alphas flocked to it and it got hammered into the ground.

And, for that matter, the hit to energy from casting spells faster isn't that big of a problem. There's Prodigy, there's BiP, there's all other sorts of energy management techniques and a lot of it resides in the Mesmer skill list. Proper energy management means you're not so much limited by energy as you are by casting and recharge times. Well, Fast Casting takes care of one of those, so when it's sufficiently good it can be quite powerful.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cce

Ok. Then perhaps it should be 55% speedup at lvl 12 before the aftercast, that'd give it roughly a 40% overall reduction in cast time. Being able to pump out 3 spells when an elementalists can only do 2 is the real value, IMHO. Beating someone to the punch is more about reflexes, and not about strategy. I like Guild Wars beacuse it doesn't require me to have fast reflexes.

Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. Now, Fast Casting is letting a Mesmer win those timing battles. But timing is twitch gaming. It depends on your reflexes and your connection speed and all the rest. It's an important facet of things but it shouldn't be *that* important. Fast Casting should let you, I don't know, cast spells faster. It's like Flurry with attack skills. You should be able to pack more spells in a shorter amount of time. It would hit the smaller casting time spells more than it would hit the larger casting spells but it would, at sufficient levels, give you that 3 spells for everyone else's 2. That's not really happening today.

Ensign · Mar 09, 2005, 06:44 AM // 06:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sausaletus Rex

Fast Casting is starting to bother me. Like Soul Reaping, it's just not up to par with other primaries. Especially when there's insanely broken, degenerative, and deformative things like Expertise walking around.

It doesn't stack up to Expertise, but what does? Expertise is disgusting. It needs to be toned down and turned into something reasonable, not an attribute that everyone dumps 14 levels into without thinking. Stop thinking like an alpha tester - attack the problem, not everything but the problem.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sausaletus Rex

Here's an insane idea. What if Fast Casting didn't work on the activation time but instead on the aftercast?

Poor. Then the attribute is only useful for chaining lots short casting time spells together. It doesn't help you react quickly or help out tactically, it just turns it into a spam attribute. That's not quite what we're looking for. The strength of Fast Cast is how it makes otherwise mediocre, 2-3 second cast spells go off quickly, making them a tactical option instead of something you have to invest and dedicate yourself to casting. The effect is actually quite good, it just doesn't quite stack up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cce

you are going to be limited by mana, and subject to interruptions.

I think that you'll find, when playing a pure Mesmer, that energy isn't nearly the concern that cooldowns are. You have a ton of great energy management skills available, between Energy Drains, Power Drains, Spirit of Failure, Shame, and a bunch of other things. Plus you're a class that's more looking to tactically cast spells, not spam them. No, energy isn't a particularly big problem.

Fast Casting also helps in those interrupt battles - the faster your spell finishes, the shorter their window of opportunity.

What is really going to limit you is your cooldowns. Most of your real money skills have cooldowns between 20 and 30 seconds, and you're going to find yourself with a lot of time with little to do. You fire off your Power Drain and Power Leak, throw up a couple hexes, Drain / Tap your way back up to full - and wait a good 10 seconds for everything to recharge. Elementalists and Monks might be bound by energy, but Mesmers most certainly are not.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cce

At lvl 12 strength, 12% penetration is roughly 40% more damage per hit

Where exactly did you pull that number from? You need to be hitting a target with roughly 170 AL to get that kind of increase in damage - and even then only when using skills. Against a more reasonable, 100 AL target, you're looking at getting a 23% damage bonus when using skills, and even with the (generous) assumption that half of your attacks are skills, you're just looking at a 12% bonus to damage with a level 12 Strength - closer to a 6% bonus versus casters.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cce

From Ensign's tables, a 12 fastcast about 20% faster , not 40%. I think in the october it was closer to 40%

There's also a huge problem here - a problem of units. While the numbers listed in the Fast Casting table are seconds per spell, the actual unit of measurement that you care about is *spells per time*. We don't want durations, we want speed.

So let's run a couple of numbers - for one, two, and three second cast times. What is the effect of a level 12 fast casting on these spells, not in terms of cast time, but in terms of speed?

1 second: 30% faster
2 seconds: 42% faster
3 seconds: 48% faster
5 seconds: 55% faster

Those are the actual, real world effects of Fast Casting. If you are casting 2-3 second casting time spells with a level 12 Fast Casting, you will be able to cast 45% more spells in a given period of time than a character without Fast Casting.

As Fast Casting stands, you *are* getting a 40% increase in your casting power. It's sitting right there in the numbers, if you look for 'em.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sausaletus Rex

Fast Casting should let you, I don't know, cast spells faster. It's like Flurry with attack skills. You should be able to pack more spells in a shorter amount of time. It would hit the smaller casting time spells more than it would hit the larger casting spells but it would, at sufficient levels, give you that 3 spells for everyone else's 2. That's not really happening today.

Funny, because that is *exactly* what it does, right now, in game. I'll add another table to the Fast Casting article, because just showing the reductions in cast times really isn't getting across the power of the attribute. You can cast 3 spells for every 2 of your opponent's right now. It's a much better attribute than you think it is.

Peace,
-CxE

Pharalon · Mar 09, 2005, 06:56 AM // 06:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

It's a much better attribute than you think it is.

Except if you're mesmer. Look down that Mesmer skill list, and you'll see a whole bunch o' ones, fair share of 2s, and the odd 3 here and there. Fast Casting is fantastic for an Ele, they've got the skills to benefit from it. A backup rezzer will benefit from it immensly. But if you're playing close to a "pure" Mesmer, you're Primary attribute just isn't doing a great deal for you, which is a bit of a worry design-wise.

Ensign · Mar 09, 2005, 07:37 AM // 07:37

That's true - the primary Mesmer pretty much runs on interrupts (which don't care about Fast Casting at all) and two second casting time spells. Now, Fast Casting absolutely *loves* two and three casting time spells, giving them a significant increase in raw power plus greatly improving their tactical flexability - but you actually have to use them.

If you just want to play an interrupting Mesmer, I agree that Fast Casting benefits you very little. But that's the same case as the Elementalist has when all you want to do is cast a low energy spam skill, or a Monk who wants to cast protections as needed instead of healing like mad. It's in your class, but it isn't really what the primary excels at. Elementalists have Energy Storage to power out a bunch of large skills quickly. Monks have Divine Favor to make a bunch of cheap, efficient spells truly shine. Mesmers, with Fast Casting, aren't masters of interrupts but of tactical shutdown. Once you get past the interrupts, what do you run on a Mesmer? Backfire? Three second cast. Shame? Two seconds. Arcane Conundrum? Also two seconds. Energy Burn and Energy Drain? Same. Energy Tap? Three. Spirit Shackles? Right in the sweet spot. The body of the Mesmer's skill base, the real workhorses that on your bar are right in the two and three second casting time range that Fast Casting wants to work with.

The only class that works with Fast Casting better is the Necromancer, as they have even more of the two and three second casting time spells that work so well with Fast Casting. Monks? Everything they use regularly casts quickly anyway. Elementalists? Energy is your concern, not how fast you can cast things - hell, they even slow themselves down with Glyphs to try and solve that problem.

Fast Casting isn't a perfect fit for the Mesmer's skill line, but it is a very good fit - and it is entirely in flavor for the class. I wouldn't touch the actual effect of the attribute at all. What I would do is add a few skills to it, ala Energy Storage, to really flesh out the Mesmer's role a bit better. For all the flack the attribute gets, I think it's decent as is - it's a solid, general effect that meshes well with the class as a whole. Exactly what you want in a primary only.

Peace,
-CxE

Mar 09, 2005, 08:11 AM // 08:11

Well thats why most people think FC sucks, they play domination mesmers, stack interrupts and say they dont see a change

I think the attribute is...only above soul reaping mainly because it doesnt seem to have a wide range of usefulness to the Mesmer primary or interrupt players.

Scaphism · Mar 09, 2005, 09:09 AM // 09:09

If we're talking about primary attributes, then strength is getting by on the strength of its skills at this point. Before when it had healing signet and did 2% AP/level it was overpowered, no question. Now the effect is mediocre, but it gives you access to a large pool of skills useful to a variety of warrior builds, AND it gives you access to a good shield.
The point: the effect meshes extremely well with what a warrior is trying to do, but the effect is weak. The attribute gets by on the strength of linked skills and a shield.

Divine Favor parallels strength in many ways- it gives a small boost to a small portion of your skills, boosting your long term healing. It also has a large pool of skills, like strength. That's where the similarities end, however. There are very few skills in the divine favor line that I'd want to use, and I don't care if my wand or focus is tied to DF, Healing, Protection, or whatever I have in my other attribute.
The effect is just about right, but the linked skills are poor.

Expertise has the strongest effect and some decent skills. The effect could be toned down, the skills are about right.

Energy Storage has a solid effect with a few once-powerful skills tied to it. If they lighten up the nerf on the skills they'll be okay. The real problem is that the elementalist is crippled without energy storage.

Fast Casting, as Engisn pointed out, fits in pretty well with the mesmer spells, but it needs more than one skill tied to it. Granted the one skill it has is nice, but there are 0 other benefits to having a high fast casting- not to mention that I don't think I've seen single wand tied to fast cast. The effect on fast cast is about right, but it needs some skills.

Soul Reaping- ah yes, the old nightmare. An effect that makes the most abysmal attribute (Death magic) less abysmal. Like your flakiest friend, he's a good guy when he's around, but not there when you need him. On top of that, it has exactly 0 skills linked to it.
The line desperately needs some linked skills AND a serious reworking. Who knows, maybe they've gone out and changed things since last BWE?

Effect: 3 of the lines have an effect that is about right, 1 is overpowered, 1 is a bit underpowered, and Soul Reaping is a mess.
Linked Skills: Expertise is about right, and the rest all need work. Strength could still lose a few skills ane be a strong line. Some of them just need more skills period. The skills linked to Divine Favor might not be great, but at least they have something. Throw SR and FC a bone.

Sausaletus Rex · Mar 09, 2005, 05:33 PM // 17:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

It doesn't stack up to Expertise, but what does? Expertise is disgusting. It needs to be toned down and turned into something reasonable, not an attribute that everyone dumps 14 levels into without thinking. Stop thinking like an alpha tester - attack the problem, not everything but the problem.

Like I'm not trying to get Expertise fixed? I mean, it's not like I'm going out of my way to mention and prove at every excuse how horribly broken it is, isn't it? How it's pretty much no longer a nice boost but a necessity for any Ranger player, not just in the decent range but as high as you can make it, eliminating flexibility and diversity from Ranger builds as far as AP go. How it's extremely overpowered, letting a primary Ranger spam away skills with decent effects, like Barrage, like Debilitating Shot, yet at the same time requires that a Ranger's skill line be so top heavy with expensive, energy intensive skills that a primary Ranger, and a high-level primary Ranger at that, is the only character that can possibly use them, turning Expertise from a nice tactical bonus to something that alters fundamental strategy. How it warps both the Ranger profession and how Ranger interacts with other professions. No, no, I guess I never mention that at all...

Expertis can be bad, the skill acquisition system can be bad, the character creation system can be bad, item availability can be bad, and I can be trying to get them all fixed and still have time to worry about Fast Casting. It's not a big priority, not as much as those other things, but it's a notch or two below where it should be.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

Funny, because that is *exactly* what it does, right now, in game. I'll add another table to the Fast Casting article, because just showing the reductions in cast times really isn't getting across the power of the attribute. You can cast 3 spells for every 2 of your opponent's right now. It's a much better attribute than you think it is.

For spells with no recharge time, maybe. You can cast 3 Chaos Storms for every 2 an Elementalist casts? You can get off more interrupts in the same amount of time than anybody else with Fast Casting? How does shaving a few seconds - going from .9 seconds on an interrupt from 1 seconds - help you cast them that much faster? At the end of three Power Leaks you'd be just .3 seconds ahead of anyone else. As you say, the real problem when chaining spells is the recycle time. When Power Leak takes 20 seconds to recharge how does shaving that .1~.2 seconds help you cast it faster? Or Chaos Storm when it takes 15 seconds?

The idea I'm getting at is that rather than being a skill that helps a Mesmer tactically - letting them have quicker reactions - that maybe it should be a bit more basic than that and let them cast their skills more rapidly than anyone else. It's simple, it's easy to explain, and it doesn't require an advanced degree in mechanics to understand - when you cast 1 spell, I cast 2 with Fast Casting. Eh, I said it was an insane idea...

But, answer me this, if Fast Casting is so good, why is it usually a dump stat?

Mar 09, 2005, 06:04 PM // 18:04

I think FC is just one of those attributes that you will never want at 12 anyway, unless they link some good skills to it. It's ok but nothing that you'd need in critical situations, or atleast not at this point in the game.

As for Strength, I have no problem with it having a bunch of skills tied to it, bringing up it's usefulness. The real problem is that warriors are usually highly specialized, so they have to choose really carefully with skill setups and that means ignoring a lot of potential options along the way. So they have their primary sitting there with a lot of skills, most of which are make or break. Then the secondary warriors dont have it and must rely on tactics?

Tactics could use some of the skills in Strength as a start. And heal sig wasn't overpowered

Ensign · Mar 09, 2005, 06:06 PM // 18:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sausaletus Rex

But, answer me this, if Fast Casting is so good, why is it usually a dump stat?

Why do people play with Ether Lord?

Peace,
-CxE

Brett Kuntz · Mar 09, 2005, 06:06 PM // 18:06

In Feb we ran a AOE elem build and did fairly well. As long as you stick together enough to make your AOE's overlap, but move around enough to make AOE cast against you not as effective, you should do good. Just make sure you have finishing skills, for when targets run away the odd time. Stuff like fireball ect, so you eat those last hp's up without giving the monks enough time to fully heal.

Spura · Mar 09, 2005, 06:25 PM // 18:25

I disagree with everybody's view of Mind Wrack and Wastrel's.
Wastrel does really good damage and using skills all the time is extremely hard to do as you run into recharges and energy problems. I have been killed by domination mesmers a lot, by the simple virtue of energy denial. Energy Drain and Energy burn and Ether feast, coupled with malaise means that pretty much every Wastrel will work and mind wrack will work as well.

Interrupts are inferior in many respects because a lot of people like me pack Mantra of Resolve.

I will also take this opportunity to let you know that cpukilla's build Suicidal Assasin doesn't work at all in the way he thinks it does. It is wildly ineffective build, and it would be good if you made sure the person actually played the build they are posting and we would be spared the theorycrafting.

mostro · Mar 09, 2005, 06:45 PM // 18:45

Can you use fast cast to sneak in spells like diversion and backfire while the enemy is casting his/her spell? Like if you see the enemy is casting deep freeze can you sneak in backfire before he finishes and still have him take damage?

I am not quite sure whether diversion or backfire are triggered by the skill/spell activation or completion.

Mar 09, 2005, 06:59 PM // 18:59

Ok, this is one of the few times I'll actually explain why Wastrels Worry is overrated, same as Mind Wrack. I'll just go straight to the point and show why they suck

First Mind Wrack:

Mind Wrack
Description:
For 20 seconds, if target foe's Energy is zero, that foe takes 20-94 damage and Mind Wrack ends.

Energy Cost:5
Casting Time:1 second
Recharge Time:5 seconds
Skill Type:Hex
Linked Attribute

omination Magic

So at anytime the foes energy hits 0, the target takes at max 94 damage. Assuming this was the case, MW would be usable. You could drain someone to 0 energy and keep getting MW to trigger! Nevermind that 94 damage every 5 secs isnt impressive, it's the fact that you'd be doing guaranteed armor ignoring damage that high. But here is the problem with it-it suffers a misleading skill description. The enemy needs to drop to 0, and go back up to 1 energy and dropped back to 0 just to get off 2 Mind Wracks. Ensign would say a caster that low on energy is already beaten, and MW isn't needed. I'd add that repeatedly energy draining someone that much to 0 energy is not only costing you more energy and time than it's worth, but you're also going against the concept of "energy denial while being efficient" as you'd be overwriting something like Malaise. Malaise stops energy regen, no matter what a caster at 2 bars of energy regen and 5 or 6 energy is in deep shit. Do you REALLY need to power leak/power drain or whatever just so you can get off another 94 damage?

Wastrels Worry. At first glance it looks ok. When I first saw it I didnt even think it was good, just "ok". Nice you can damage someone for not doing something! Then it kicks in...

Wastrels Worry
Description:After 3 seconds, target foe takes 8-53 damage. Wastrel's Worry ends prematurely if that foe uses a skill.
Energy Cost:5
Casting Time:1 second
Recharge Time:1 second
Skill Type:Hex
Linked Attribute

omination Magic

I'm fully convinced you'd have to be a total idiot to worry about this. First of all, it's latent damage. 53 latent damage. 3 seconds after you cast it and works on a target that doesnt use a skill. Here is pretty much a fundamental argument to be made: If a player isn't doing anything, isn't he/she pretty much useless to his team anyway? The skill is more than just 5 energy for 53 damage. It's 5 energy, 3 seconds of time and a dumbass or severly beaten player to get good use out of.

Combining WW+Backfire:
I think this argument that people use to justify the use of WW just so happens to show why it's really a bad skill. Hex a player with both of these and see what a smart person would do. Cast through backfire. Take the damage and get healed for it. Why? Because smart people understand that doing SOMETHING is better than standing around and waiting 3 seconds or more for some action. WW is spammable because if it had even a 2 second recharge, I think people would catch on to how bad it really is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mostro

Can you use fast cast to sneak in spells like diversion and backfire while the enemy is casting his/her spell? Like if you see the enemy is casting deep freeze can you sneak in backfire before he finishes and still have him take damage?

I am not quite sure whether diversion or backfire are triggered by the skill/spell activation or completion.

Well Backfire is a hex, not really an interrupt so fast casting it isn't "necessary". But it has a 3 second casting time so FC benefits it nicely.

Diversion isn't an interrupt also. But if you want to diversion a certain skill timing would be nice, since it counters the "throw away" option by just eliminating it. It's on a 2 second cast time, so FC also benefits it.

Basically they arent interrupts so the timing of them isn't crucial, but timing them to get off on a certain spell or skill is "ok". Better for diversion, but not so critical for backfire.

Also they are both triggered by activation of the spell/skill, not the completion.

Ensign · Mar 09, 2005, 08:17 PM // 20:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sausaletus Rex

Like I'm not trying to get Expertise fixed?

No, of course you aren't. We talk about how absurdly broken Expertise is because we hate the game and are trying to scare people away, not because we're trying to draw attention to a problem so it can be fixed. We're just a bunch of whiners, not a fanbase making critical observations about the game.

Shame on you for thinking otherwise.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sausaletus Rex

For spells with no recharge time, maybe.

Solve one problem, and you run smack into another one. Solve your energy problems and you start standing around waiting for skills to cool down. Solve your cooldown problems, and you start choking on your cast times. Figure out how to cast fast enough, and suddenly you're draining your energy too quickly again.

Energy costs, cast times, and cooldowns are the rules that govern skill usage. A primary attribute can solve one of these problems for you, but you have to work around the other two on your own.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sausaletus Rex

As you say, the real problem when chaining spells is the recycle time.

In the midgame, yes, recycles end up becoming the most relevant. But not in the early game - when time is most sensitive and all of your skills are fresh, casting times dominate.

Casting times rule the first ten to fifteen seconds of an encounter, when you can fire off all your skills and your only limit is how quickly you can do so. After that until around the 30-40 second mark, cooldowns rule - you still have juice left over, but you're using normal attacks while waiting a few seconds for a key spell to refresh itself. After that you're in the long game where energy starts to dominate - your skills are fresh and you have the time to use them, but you're just waiting to regenerate enough energy to use them.

Obviously different character builds will move through these different limiting stages in different ways - you can skip cooldown limiting entirely with good design, and you'll hit the energy wall at different times - but one of them is always going to be an issue. I wouldn't say that any of them are fundamentally more important than the others.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sausaletus Rex

The idea I'm getting at is that rather than being a skill that helps a Mesmer tactically - letting them have quicker reactions - that maybe it should be a bit more basic than that and let them cast their skills more rapidly than anyone else.

By shortening their cooldowns? That's an idea, but if you do so you're just going to start slamming into the casting time and energy walls. That's just how these things work.

But, on that note, I do think that fast casting needs a little kick, and since the actual mechanics of it are fine that means a few more linked skills. Mantra of Recovery is a good model even if the skill itself is weak (for an elite) - toss Serpent's Quickness, or something similar, into fast casting and the attribute becomes that much more attractive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sausaletus Rex

But, answer me this, if Fast Casting is so good, why is it usually a dump stat?

Ok, an actually serious answer this time.

The first reason is because so many primary Mesmer builds are Illusionary Weaponry builds. IW doesn't use a lot of spells, but stacks buffs and attack skills instead. They don't do a whole lot of casting - they're really just Mesmer so that they can pump Illusion through the roof. So Fast Casting isn't all that important, hence the dump stat.

Another reason is because of the unhealthy reliance on interrupts in the game right now. With the lack of viable enchantment and hex removal, interrupting those spells while they're being cast ends up being the best solution to the rampant use of enchantments and hexes. If you're using a bunch of interrupts, you aren't using the proactive spells that Fast Casting really loves. So when your character starts with Power Block, Power Drain, Power Leak, and Power Spike, Fast Casting takes a hit.

But I think the big reason Fast Casting isn't used much is because people just underrate it. It is a powerful effect despite how low the numbers look, and you can feel how much better it's making you in game - your skills just kinda go off when you use them instead of it being some involved process. Time management is a bit more advanced than energy management, making Fast Casting a less obvious attribute, but that doesn't change how it affects your win/loss record at all. It's a solid attribute. Don't underrate it.

Peace,
-CxE

Sausaletus Rex · Mar 09, 2005, 10:22 PM // 22:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

No, of course you aren't. We talk about how absurdly broken Expertise is because we hate the game and are trying to scare people away, not because we're trying to draw attention to a problem so it can be fixed. We're just a bunch of whiners, not a fanbase making critical observations about the game.

Shame on you for thinking otherwise.

Right. My mistake. ANet is good. ANet is great. All is right and well with the game and we're perfectly on schedule for release with no flaws and no misteps. Everything is fine. Nothing to see here. Move along.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

But I think the big reason Fast Casting isn't used much is because people just underrate it. It is a powerful effect despite how low the numbers look, and you can feel how much better it's making you in game - your skills just kinda go off when you use them instead of it being some involved process. Time management is a bit more advanced than energy management, making Fast Casting a less obvious attribute, but that doesn't change how it affects your win/loss record at all. It's a solid attribute. Don't underrate it.

I suppose that's my whole problem with it. It's not an attribute that's any good on the surface. Not to the vast majority of people. That primary is something every Mesmer gets. It needs to be obvious. Perhaps better documentation of attribute effects in game would help. But to that player who's just picked up GW and doesn't understnad the first thing about energy management the idea of time management is going to be just as hard to get accross. When they put points into Fast Casting and nothing obvious happens, they forget about it. The effect should be something noticable, hell, flip it around with Mantra of Recovery. Fast Casting lowers recharge. Mantra of Recovery/Whatever you'd call it lowers casting times. Since there are Mesmer builds that can safely and justifiably ignore it, just like there are Monk builds that can ignore Divine Favor, there's a problem.

Although, more skills would be a way to go, too...

Ensign · Mar 09, 2005, 10:59 PM // 22:59

If you think casting times aren't obvious, try to explain why cooldown management is important. If Fast Casting is subtle, Fast Recharge is downright invisible.

You're right, though, people just look at big numbers and think that's all there is to a class - just look at how high demand a skill like Rodgort's Invocation is. Random J. Scrub understands that more energy is better. But I don't think they need to cater every single class to Mr. Scrub. It even says in the description that the Mesmer is a trickier class to play - if someone picks that and expects to be hit over the head with a duh stick, they deserve what they get.

Peace,
-CxE